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23 November 2013 @ 07:09 pm
day of the doctor reaction post!  
What did everyone think?

Spoilers in the comments below!
jedi_of_urth: seperatedjedi_of_urth on November 24th, 2013 01:41 am (UTC)
Very short version: meh.
Still short version: Okay I guess, until the end which I really didn't like.

I'm still kind of working through how I feel, I wrote up a full reaction post, but that's just kind of a start to figuring out where on the scale of okay it ended up. I know I wouldn't give it any more than an okay, but there are levels of okay and this fluctuated between several of them, and then ended badly unfortunately. About what I expected from Moffat, making my main reaction 'I miss Rusty.'
Rosa | ¯\(ºдಠ)/¯: m/f: dividerosaxx50 on November 24th, 2013 01:50 am (UTC)
I ended up enjoying it, particularly the second half. Though I was sad that we didn't get any Rose or even any Billie & David interacting on screen, we did get some footage of the earlier Doctors.
only arceus can have a perfect blog: you'd be dead if it weren't for me.spud14 on November 24th, 2013 01:57 am (UTC)
Jen: Ten/Rose srslycinamoncupcake on November 24th, 2013 02:16 am (UTC)
things I liked:
*billie's face
*david's face
*john hurt's exasperation with ten and eleven
*kate just all around
*ten/elizabeth not being a gitf redux + bonus points for making that 'her nickname isn't exactly...' line palatable aka not a 'i shagged the virgin queen, oh yeah' and more 'she's not the virgin queen b/c i married her and her people all saw it #awkward'
*ten + eleven's interplay
*the moment picking rose tyler's form
*the exchange between not!rose and not!doctor about kissing her
*capaldi cameo
*that tom baker showed up, i guess - lol that made no sense and was a cop-out, but i take what i can get

things I didn't like:
*ten/elizabeth. he's a cold douchenozzle and she's a moping, mooning, bastardized version of herself, complete with forcing kisses AND marriage on ten
*not!doctor - eight should've been there. never gonna feel differently. hurt is talented and played the crotchety old man well, but i was nhft
*actually, everything about elizabeth in this. WHY?
*billie wasn't rose - expected, but i didn't like it. even bw!rose would have been better. got your viewers, though, hey moffat?
*not!rose only seen/heard by not!doctor - again, expected, but still completely infuriating and wasteful
*retcon, retcon, retcon - suddenly, the time lords were all innocent bystanders and stuff. new doctor who came from nowhere. 'all 13!' excuse u, if we're playing it that way, it's '13 of 14 omg!!!' because tentoo exists
*clara was there to...stand around and look pretty, making watery calf eyes and propping up eleven at the expense of the other two doctors?
*eleven spending most of the special pretending not!doctor was, well, not him. points to ten for taking responsibility.
*recycled jokes
*recycled lines - no, moffat. you don't get to re-use ~that line. no.
*the doctorS (all three of them) are fucking idiots who don't think to try a door handle
*the fez - srsly no. keep your childish, ridic doctor nonsense away from mah ten
*GALLIFREY NEVER BURNED BECAUSE HAHAHA WHAT IS ACTUAL CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT, EMOTIONAL FALL-OUT, AND COMPLEX, MOVING STORYTELLING?? - no no no. I just...there are not words for how livid and disgusted and disappointed I am by this move.
*all of new who is now retconned
*all that angst and powerful story-telling of the first four series (and incl. glimpses in eleven's era, let's not forget) are rendered moot because he just forgot he saved everyone is all
*um...nine didn't 'feel' his people because of reasons?
*the end of time was, er, a massive hallucination? the nightmare of rassilon?

in sum: no. go away. so let down (even going in with minimal expectations, as I did)

Edited at 2013-11-24 02:19 am (UTC)
Rosa | ¯\(ºдಠ)/¯: m/f: dividerosaxx50 on November 24th, 2013 03:17 am (UTC)
*billie wasn't rose - expected, but i didn't like it. even bw!rose would have been better. got your viewers, though, hey moffat?
*not!rose only seen/heard by not!doctor - again, expected, but still completely infuriating and wasteful

That burned - he got Billie back, but didn't even let Rose and Ten interact.
(no subject) - sherrilina on November 24th, 2013 03:33 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - effervescent on November 24th, 2013 04:00 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - havamahal on November 24th, 2013 04:05 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - jedi_of_urth on November 24th, 2013 04:38 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - havamahal on November 24th, 2013 06:07 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - vanimy on November 25th, 2013 10:10 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - havamahal on November 26th, 2013 05:43 am (UTC) (Expand)
(Deleted comment)
Naïvety's Star: Roselady_noremon on November 24th, 2013 02:33 am (UTC)
When "The Night of The Doctor" first aired I tried to head!canon that Hurt Doctor was like Morbius' ruthlessness/the Sisterhood's Sacred Flame propelling Eight's mid-regeneration corpse to do what he had to, to end the war. I was all ":[" at the writer trying to make him into the actual Nine.
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - lady_noremon on November 24th, 2013 02:43 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - sherrilina on November 24th, 2013 03:34 am (UTC) (Expand)
sherrilina: Doomsday Ten/Rosesherrilina on November 24th, 2013 03:37 am (UTC)
It was better than I expected, which isn't saying much. I was just worried above all that it would be current!Rose and that Moffat would screw with that canon, so since he didn't do so I felt relieved--the Time Lord retcon was stupid too, but I don't care as much.

I did wish Ten had been able to see Billie though. :( His reaction at hearing BW mentioned was perfect. But ugh he whole E1 thing was so stupid.
Rosa | ¯\(ºдಠ)/¯: m/f: dividerosaxx50 on November 24th, 2013 07:00 am (UTC)
His reaction at hearing BW mentioned was perfect.

Lol for the 2 seconds anyway... and then he went back to focusing on Trenzalore which, WHAT. LIKE HE WOULDN'T BE FOCUSED ON ROSE/BAD WOLF.
meandering: Base - look out from the balconyeffervescent on November 24th, 2013 04:19 am (UTC)
Things I loved:

- David Tennant!
- surprisingly, I quite liked John Hurt. I am ready to accept him.
- Tom Baker!!!!
- the interaction with the three Doctors :D
- Billie Piper, even if she wasn't our!Rose

I had a lot of questions, though. LIke - how they did they get out of the timestream? Did Moffat just forget about that? Did he think about the fact that he's making Ten go from apparently saving all of Gallifrey to sending it back in the next episode? What happened to the Xygons?

And I'm super frustrated with all the people handwaving and saying 'lol it's okay guys, the Doctors don't remember so nothing's changed!'. IT'S BIGGER THAN THAT. For fuck's sake, from the viewer's perspective an ENORMOUS part of the Doctor's backstory was just altered, something that shaped him for the last eight years from our point of view, and over four hundred years for the Doctor. The fact that he *thought* that he had killed his entire species doesn't change the fact that a lot of that depth and meaning was just sucked out. At least he'd done that to himself, it wasn't that someone else had wiped out his memory of it...

I'm looking forward to seeing the Doctor hopefully - maybe - be a little happier, definitely. I just wish that it hadn't been such a huge retcon.

havamahal: foreverhavamahal on November 24th, 2013 06:11 am (UTC)
I had a lot of questions, though. LIke - how they did they get out of the timestream? Did Moffat just forget about that?

Lol! That's what I've been wondering the whole 75 minutes, thinking it would be explained. I'm guessing Moffat's motto is something like: "When there's no way out, just ignore it."?
Rose Tyler: Gazing || Came back for youmissrosetyler on November 24th, 2013 08:27 am (UTC)
I liked it except for the lack of interaction between 10 and Rose. Something however struck me, if you can recall when that pic of Billie's stunt double was leaked, it implied that there were heavy action scenes with her. However, I didn't see anything with what they showed that could've required a stunt double unless there's an extra or cut scene. I'm hoping that there is. Still want an explanation as to why the interface chose Rose in tattered clothes.
cyandevil: pic#116332217cyandevil on November 24th, 2013 08:50 am (UTC)
I think I'm going to stick with Big Finish in terms of my fix on Doctor Who now. At least until Moffat is no longer showrunner (please let that be soon!).

Overall, eh. I enjoyed it more than I expected but at the same time disgusted.

1. Billie (all the Billie) (even if she's not really as the person she's suppose to be)
2. Capaldi showing up
3. Ten's hairerection that only current at the "Bad Wolf" split (damn straight)
4. Tom Baker (weird and makes no sense) but this is a nice salute to ClassicWho
5. John Hurt was not as bad as I expected, still unnecessary but not as bad

1. Retconning of Gallifrey burning. Like for reals. BURN THAT SHIT UP. TIME LORDS ARE DOUCHEBAGS. BURN GALLIFREY. What are you going to do now Doctor? Find them? But you know those Time Lords will still be crazed douchebags out to control all of time and space to their own purposes. They'll be worse than the Daleks. Great job. Like seriously Rassilon is major asshole and you will be getting that back.
2. Total undermining of all the angst of 9/10/11 about burning Gallifrey. Total disregard to just good narrative. Moffat you really suck.
3. ALL that QE1 stuff. Just all of it. It was awkward to see it and see Ten being forced and the way QE1 was depicted and just sexist and horrible and unnecessary to the plot at all. Like why is this necessary. Zygons + QE1 - WHY? Also are you fucking kidding me? WORST solution EVER. Zygons and humans what? Live together happily ever after? This fuckers eat humans. It's their nature to survivor and eat humans. Trust me. Eight tried this with the Zygons once and it does NOT work out. (Even with the good Zygons).
4. Moment!Bad Wolf!Rose!Whatever does not get to interact with anyone but John Hurt. Knew this was going to happen. But still ugh.

One shining good thing to take away from this all:
Rose Tyler + TenToo still lives happily ever after in Pete's World, untouched by the evil hands of Moffat.

Edited at 2013-11-29 05:58 am (UTC)
sati_lotus: Rose & Not Quite Doctorsati_lotus on November 24th, 2013 11:30 am (UTC)
I was pretty confused about the whole EoT 'retcon' too, but dojorkanexplain it this way to me in another thread, and I thought it made sense:

I think there are two different things, a time lock and whatever The Moment does.

The lady in The End of Time says that "The Doctor has the Moment and will use it to destroy Time Lord and Dalek alike". So they are ALREADY time locked but haven't been actually subject to the use of The Moment. So apparently Rassalion and those guys were trying to get out of the Time Lock because they assumed The Doctor was going to use The Moment, which he hadn't yet.

I've seen posts on Tumblr about it too - the High Council isn't shown, but are mentioned as being in a meeting, which I took to mean as what they're doing in EoT. So nothing has changed there.

And consider this: The Doctor know knows that he's felt all this guilt for over 400 years, three regenerations - BASICALLY FOR NO REASON. He's just learned that his homeworld, his friends, his FAMILY, is out there, somewhere in the universe, waiting to be found. People he LOVED and thought he had killed. He's been given the hope that they're out there, waiting for him to rescue him from the Time Lock. That is a hell of a carrot to be dangling in front of him. We know he's capable of doing terrible things (Pompeii, anyone?). How DESPERATE do you think this is going to make him? Desperation and hope aren't necessarily a good mix.

The Doctor's personality changes with each regeneration. Just what sort of traits could the Twelfth Doctor have because of this?
shippy_dalek: Christopher Ecclestonshippy_dalek on November 24th, 2013 01:37 pm (UTC)
Warning: lots of feelings.

Some things I liked:

- Capaldi, my love
- a glimpse of Nine, even if it was from some older ep
- Billie Piper was beautiful and wonderful
- David Tennant
- I haven't actually watched anything from series 5-7, but I quite liked Matt Smith. Indifferent toward Eleven, though.
- Daleks were actually kinda scary in that little scene in the beginning, where they surrounded a fleeing family on Gallifrey or sth.
- Ten never actually shagged Queen Elizabeth, that was good to know.
- Ten's and Eleven's faces at the mention of Bad Wolf girl.
- Ten telling off Eleven in the Tower. "Is that what it takes to forget something like that?" I loved it.

Things I hated and general 'wat' moments.

- "This is the same sonic screwdriver - same interface, new shell" or something. But didn't Ten, like, fry his and build a new one in Smith and Jones? Help me out here gaiz!
- Where is Ten from in this ep? I always thought he was from between WoM and EoT. If so, then his angst and crazy were totally ignored. Well done, Moffat.
- What was the effing point of the War Doctor or whatever?! Nothing against John Hurt personally, but there is absolutely no reason why Paul McGann couldn't have played his role!!! I need a drink.
- The Queen Elizabeth bullshit. I'm not really a feminist, so I don't see sexism in everything involving portrayal of women (no offence to feminists). But damn, this was not Queen Elizabeth that I've ever heard of. So this amazing, powerful monarch, who refused to ever marry, was actually head over heels over this weird bloke in a suit whom she's known for... not really that long? And practically dragged him to the altair even though he didn't seem all that interested? And the Doctor messing around with historical figures like that? Only in Moffat scripts, I s'ppose. I don't even know.
- I guess my theory about BP being some new space!fairy who looks like Rose because reasons was right, lol. What was the role of the BadWolf Interface? So the Moment is sentient. And all it did in the episode was asking John Hurt how many kids were on Gallifrey and pointing out the sonic screwdriver thing in the Tower? There'e so much more that could be done with the "sentient machine" plot and it was all wasted. Boo.
- BIllie's outfit makes a bit more sense now, but wouldn't her "Punky Fish" hoodie and black jeans make even more sense, if her character was supposed to look like the BadWolf!Rose?
- And why does it seem like they're treating Rose and Bad Wolf as two separate characters? And I hate that they made it seem that the BW!Rose was somehow more important to him than actual Rose. Rose was the 'Bad Wolf', dammit! Bad Wolf wasn't even a character, IMO. These were the words that were there when Rose absorbed the time vortex and she chose to scatter them in time and space as messages to herself and the Doctor (because the word 'corporation' would be less ominous). What she means by "I am the Bad Wolf" is "These two words that followed us everywhere we went? That was me, actually".
- What was the point of the zygons? I don't even know.
- A very minor thing, but what was the point of that museum girl wearing a Doctor-esque scarf? So that the fans would go "squee"? It would maybe pass as a reference to Four, but who the hell wears long-ass scarfs at work? That seemed incredibly forced.
- Moffat's recycled jokes. Timey-wimey, machine that goes "ding", spoilers.. just shoot me now. It's one thing when fans use them (I do)), but when the writer himself keeps telling them, it's like him saying "Ahahaha, damn, I'm funny!".
- I better not get started with the not!destroying Gallifrey BS. Somewhere in the beginning of the ep I thought for a moment "Oh, now they're going to ~save Gallifrey, aren't they", but then I was like "Nah, it would be too obvious, ofc they won't". So by the end of the episode. I don't even know what I felt. Way to piss on the previous 7 seasons, Moffat. Now Nine and Ten look like morons every time they mourn their planet and angst about destroying it. "Dalek" makes no sense anymore. Nor does the End of Time. Omfg, EoT, how the hell are we supposed to interpret everything that went on in these episodes?
Edit: the engagement ring meant nothing after all, lol

Edited at 2013-11-24 09:05 pm (UTC)
logicisfailing: daleklogicisfailing on November 25th, 2013 06:10 am (UTC)
"- Where is Ten from in this ep? I always thought he was from between WoM and EoT."
I haven't watched the special yet, but from my understanding, 10 was from pre-S3. Not positive though...
(no subject) - effervescent on November 26th, 2013 05:48 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - effervescent on November 26th, 2013 05:47 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - shippy_dalek on November 26th, 2013 05:58 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - effervescent on November 27th, 2013 07:53 am (UTC) (Expand)
Stephanie: Rose/Ten Snow Together as it should bex_girl_wonder_x on November 25th, 2013 06:45 pm (UTC)
I did like it- overall, more than I expected (than again, I had zero expectations). But I am not happy with it simply being a retcon of the new doctor who stuff. I just... I didn't appreciate that.

In the end, I'm happy it wasn't the real Rose- but it bothered me so much that they basically advertise Billie's return as Rose Tyler- the end credits even credit her as 'Rose.' That said, I'm fine with it not being her:

1) Because Moffat sucks, so I'm happy he didn't have the chance to ruin Rose's happy ending.

2) Billie really got to stretch her acting chops and she did marvelous job.

3) The way I want to see it- is that The Moment went through all of the Doctor's life- past, present, and future, and out of all the possible companions to pick, it picked Rose (although in Bad Wolf form) for a reason . And I like to think it's because Rose was always his conscience- she always understood what the Doctor needed to do. She was that important in his long life, that The Moment chose her out of all the possible choices. So, to me, that means a lot.

Buuut, I hate, hate, hate that Billie and David didn't get a scene truly together. Even when Ten asks about Bad Wolf, it is immediately forgotten.

If I had it my way, we would have seen the return of Rose and Tentoo.

Also John Hurt acted very, very well, but WHY was he needed? Why not bring back Eight???

Did love Four's return- but uh, was that just a wink to the audience or will that ever be explained, since it actually makes no sense?

I am SO ready for Capaldi, pity Mofatt will be the writer for his doctor. He deserves better.

I did tear up at the end- thought that was pretty amazing.

However, the whole sexist portrayal of Elizabeth I and the Zygons thing was super disastrous, I didn't care for any of that. And they just simply dropped that storyline, it was really sloppy.
badwolfgoodlove: lastfaceforTenbadwolfgoodlove on November 26th, 2013 01:58 am (UTC)
Bad Wolf IS Rose, though Rose isn't always Bad Wolf. BW never would have happened without the unique being Rose creating her. It really is Rose, not a supernatural separate being. Just like the Doctor said to Jack in Utopia, "Everything she did was so human". Therefore, it is accurate to call Bad Wolf "Rose".

Plus, The Moment chose her form because of her familiarity with the Doctor, and he was in love with the human side of her. In a way, it was incredibly romantic. Out of all of the comforting companions that could have been chosen to inspire the Doctor, Rose was the best choice. It's the one thing he believes in.

This is me trying to think of one nice thing to say about that ruddy episode XD
(no subject) - gnarly_unicorn on November 27th, 2013 01:24 am (UTC) (Expand)
Rosie: Stana Katic flowerrosie_not_rose on November 27th, 2013 07:04 pm (UTC)
I enjoyed some of it, mainly the interactions between 11 and 10. But as usual with Moffat, it was very overcomplicated and I only followed half of the plot. I also think the time war should never really be shown, y'know? Like, it's much more effective in our imaginations. And then to wipe it all out... oh dearie me.

Obviously gutted that Billie and David had no interaction on screen. Are there any backstage pics with D/B? They at least got to team up again, even if the Doctor and Rose didn't.
havamahal: Christopher Ecclestonhavamahal on November 30th, 2013 11:36 pm (UTC)
Are there any backstage pics with D/B?

Haven't seen any so far, but there is a clip with them in 'The Day Of The Doctor - Behind The Lens' video. I made couple of screencaps, but I'm sure you can find better ones on various sites and especially gifs on Tumblr. :)

mornea: pic#100475874mornea on November 30th, 2013 10:52 pm (UTC)
I flippin' loved it.
Seeing what Bad Wolf actually DID... oh, that fits the TARDIS, it fits Rose, and... whatever other entity joined to make Bad Wolf.

Loved the whole episode. I can find bits to pick at if I want, but I'm too happy with it to try.